Toon v. Fulham [R]

wow. cant say sitting in a car for 12 hours anticipating this (crap) result was fun.

dear lord where to begin...

 

Hatter, since you clearly have historical perspective on how things work in the league, if, God forbid, we end up going down, what is likely to happen and why would it be difficult or easy for us to be right back up the following year? Is it the loss of the 1 or 2 quality players we have? I'm curious what has historically happened with teams that have been relegated. Thanks. It ain't over yet, so keep the faith!

 

Note to self: do NOT mention opposing strikers in thread regarding upcoming match.

That being said, they were not the same team I saw on Monday, and FFC was not the same team I saw on Sunday: NU seemed to get most of the 50-50 balls, and our passes/thoughts within the final third of the pitch were, well, um, er, not good. Plenty of chances, but not well taken. Ugh.

Oh, and when a team does go down from the top division, players seem to leave like rats abandoning a sinking ship. Most players want to play in the EPL, not for a particular club.

 

So. Depressed.

I know that we spent a lot of cash on EJ. But he's not ready to be THE guy. He needs time, buildup, and waaaaay more guidance, and I really wish Roy knew that.

Sure, we're not exactly bursting with guys to pair McBride with (hell, see the last few years of the US Nats), but EJ is not a miracle worker. He's a kid, with potential, and a history of not performing well on a big stage. He's not the guy to pin our hopes on, and when I see Roy subbing out McBride, a proven workhorse to the closing minutes, and leaving EJ in to flounder, it really makes me question his understanding of his players' strengths.

Full disclosure, I've been whining about EJ for years now.

I suppose mathematically we may still have a chance, but what did that game to their confidence? After Viduka's goal, they alternately looked stunned and frantic.

 

Newcastle won every loose ball, they attacked with confidence and they were hustling. I really did not see that from FFC. It was depressing. Isn't there urgency?

Johnson had better touches on the ball in this match, but none of them were going forward. I do not recall any real shots coming from anyone other than Bullard.

It got to the 60th minute, and I am calling for a sub. I am thinking Dempsey in for anyone on the midfield line except Bullard, a few minutes later Dempsey is up, I feel a little better and Roy takes out McBride. I am not getting this at all.

 

To sum it up fully, the team is not playing like a team that is trying to fight of relegation. Too many times did they settle for long shots (Bullard!) and passing it too many times instead of taking a shot for themselves. In possession, there were many times where I thought some additional effort on the field would lead to better chances - only Fulham didn't take them at all.

Derby is next and it's now a must-win.

 

I had good feelings going into this game also, and I finally got to see it last night. Pretty disappointing, but you've got to love that crazy weather...hail, rain, snow, sun, and the pigeons. I think it came down to the Brown Ale's wanting it a little more. I'm sad to say.

Let's hope we get some changes for Derby. I'd like Dempsey in for Murphy and another striker bessides EJ. He had his back to the goal the majority of the game and keep passing back and not turning. Roy's talking up Litmanen, so maybe we'll see him somewhere besides the trainer's table. What about Nevland? Healy? EJ and McBride really aren't clicking together, but not much was at Newcastle.

 

I waited to return from my in-laws house Sun. nite to watch the DVR of the match. After the 6th minute goal, I couldn't stand it and fast-forwarded to the regrettable end. As I'm watching the SIX MINUTES, I'm thinking to myself that they are going to score because the boombaclot/idiot in charge of FFC has chosen Danny Murphy to protect our back 4. Watch in slow motion as he stands still (Is that an oxymoron?) and doesn't challenge Viduka. I WILL REPEAT MY DIATRIBE.....UNLESS WE BENCH MURPHY, MOVE ANDREASEN TO DEFENSIVE MID CONVINCING HIM TO SUPPORT THE BACK 4 FIRST, AND PLAY DEMPSEY MORE, WE ARE FINISHED. How can an American from North Carolina see that so clearly and Woy cannot? Mike, I can't imagine how dissapointed you are. Hang in there, brother.......

 

I hate to say it, but we didn't deserve anything out of that game. Bullard, Stalteri and Konchesky played pretty well but that's about it. McBride and Johnson didn't see enough of the ball to be effective. Murphy's passing was off and I think he needs to take a seat so that Andreasen can move to the middle (he's obviously uncomfortable on the wing) and we can play two real outside midfielders.

 

Does anyone know how to forward (in a positive way of course) to someone within FFC what seems so clear to most of us on this site.......I know it's a pipe dream, but at least it made me feel better to type it........

 

Re: RE: Toon v. Fulham [R]

Roy has said as much. He's said EJ is 2 or 3 years behind an English player the same age... because he learned to play in the U.S. He's said he wished he had better options so he wouldn't have to play EJ.

It's amazing how one big loss leads to statements such as "the coach doesn't know his players", or "if this guy was in and this other guy out; different outcome".

Fulham simply isn't a very talented side. Newcastle as a team sucks, particularly their defense, but they have a lot of individual talent. They had almost 3 world class forwards playing in the game. Sometimes just have those 2 or 3 world beaters will sink anybody's ship.

... and just last week all the fans were saying that McBride and EJ played quite well together (whether they did or didn't).

EJ did well enough on Saturday. He's gotten comfortable at least playing at the EPL level. He's clearly coachable and doing exactly what they they tell him... which is collect, hold, and distribute. He did that just fine. He as also pretty good at times in the air, but Newcastle did have two CB's who are were good in the air (both were taller and stronger than McBride or EJ)

Dempsey can't play in a 4-4-2 at the EPL level. Andreasen probably has never played in CM role in a 4-4-2 coming from Germany (although I imagine he could figure it out). So that's why you see Murphy and Bullard.

Hodgson just bad option, after bad option. There's only so much he can do with what he has.

Newcastle looked beatable, but it was only a matter of time until Viduka, Owen, and Martins did their thing against some unfortunate foe.

 

RE: Re: RE: Toon v. Fulham [R]

Understood, Lyle, but I stand by my statement. I'm not basing my opinion on "one big loss," but an accumulation of choices. This game was absolutely crucial, and I truly do not understand Roy's tactics, or the complete deflation of the guys after the first goal, in a must-win scenario.

Newcastle are currently beatable, and we didn't beat 'em. I agree that Hodgson is faced with a player pool problem, but in my view he exacerbates it with his positioning, starting, and substituting choices.

Frankly, people can say all they want about what an intelligent manager and all-around great guy Roy is, but at the end of the day, results are literally the only yardstick by which the team can be judged.

I'm sure all of us on this side of the pond can agree that relegation, which is what we are absolutely facing after a game of this poor quality, is especially harsh for those of us who have little to no chance of actually seeing the team play again until/unless they win promotion sooner than average. That makes me feel particularly raw in terms of a bad performance at a crucial time.

Your mileage may vary.

 

RE: Re: RE: Toon v. Fulham [R]

I genereally agree with all of the comments, especially that Murphy needs to go (put Davies back on the right, and Dempsey on the left, with Andreason behind Bullard in the middle).

I will comment on Konch, however. I thought he had a horrible game offensively. He lost the ball a lot and his passing left much to be desired. It may be time to give Boca another look at LB.

 

Re: RE: Re: RE: Toon v. Fulham [R]

He seems to lose his mind when he gets in the offensive third, and hardly ever sends in effective crosses when he has the chance, especially now that we have BMB back. As far as defensive mid is concerned there are no successful clubs in Europe who play without at least one defensive-minded midfielder. So I'll put it out there, if not Andreasen then who? And why doesn't Roy and his staff get this?

 

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Toon v. Fulham [R]

All I can say, and I'm not exactly sure what this means because I am sad...but what I know is that since Roy has been here we've gotten three points against Everton and Villa

...what did we have before he was here?

He's doing fine, we're not down yet, and when he got here it was almost inevitable...he's trying things out and to his credit has changed the line-up considerably from what it was before he was here...

Stalteri is good, Hangeland had a bad game but is good, Andreasen is good, EJ will be good once he get confidence and quits relying on Murphy to get him the ball cause that will never happen...

We need three this week and we will get it...UP the FULHAM!!!

 

Hapless. Utterly hapless.
I 10th the motion to drop Murphy and put Andreasen in as a central defending midfielder. Murphy is slow, loses possession, and only looks to pass to Bullard. EJ isn't ready for Premiership level of play. Every fan site, British or American is screaming for
------Bullard------
-Demps-----Davies
-----Andreasen

What is Roy seeing that we're not?

 

Wow, reading this board is just a depressing as the English ones. Take how you feel about losing and then compound that by having to stay in Newcastle Saturday and having to hear from everyone how great keegan is and how great their team played! Ha. I've lost all respect for the Geordies after seeing how they 'love' their 'great' manager. Idiots.

It was a very disappointing display by our boys and Newcastle just wanted it more. I was very disappointed with how easily Bullard and Konchesky were giving away the ball. Between them we must of passed to a Newcastle player 15 times!

Keller did very well but I felt he should've done better about Viduka's shot.

Overall, it is a typical Fulham let down and I think it simply comes down to the mental game. How can we do so well against Everton yet lose to a poor Newcastle side?

Now the pressure is really, really on and it won't be easy at all...

 

Hangeland was at fault for Viduka's goal, not really Keller. Brede didn't close him down once he was inside the box.

 

Lyle - agreed. I believe that even if big ol' Hangeland had even just threw his leg out there, it would have rushed Viduka in to a wide shot.

 

If having great fans could pull us through, we'd be in great shape because you could hear the Fulham fans loud and clear. You can feel proud about doing your part for the team, Mike. Thanks.........