Soccer 101 question..actually 2

Being fairly new to this site, Fulham and soccer in general, I am still learning the game and many times have a hard time noticing the more subtle aspects of the game as it flys by on the television screen.....so I was hoping the FulhamUSA soccer junkies can bear with me and answer a couple of nagging questions about the game I have had running around in my mind. Thanks to all the great information on this site!

So here they are:

1) Right and left fullbacks often go 'deep' into the offensive end of the field. I have thought this to be dangerous because it leaves them open on the wings on defense. I assume it is because the right and left midfielders tend to collapse more towards the middle when the ball is near the goal or maybe the left or right fullbacks help the midfielders on the 'wings' retain possession as a passing option, so they can create more crossing balls or just more oppty's to get the ball into the middle for the strikers. Can someone explain this to me?

2) Set pieces - Especially corner kicks - If you are a slower team, like Fulham, I wondered if it makes sense for this type of a team to be really focused on perfectly their form on set-pieces...I'm mostly thinking of corner kicks (we have Jimmy Bullard after all for free kicks), meaning practicing it a lot because you they don't create enough real scoring oppty's during actual play like Arsenal, Manu, Liverpool seem to game after game. Villa has a reputation for being great at set-pieces....is this something teams 'choose' to be good at? Or does it have more to do with the type of players you have.

Inquiring minds would love to know.

Thanks all for any feedback.

 

1) Attacking fullbacks has more recently come into existance. The likes of Liam, Konch, Finnan, Evra, Cole... have made play more free flowing offensively. The ability for a fullback to get forward allows, as you said, the wingers to fade into the center or helps to release the winger down the touch line thus adding width to the attack. More players are brought back defensively which makes a counter attack system all the more popular. Wenger has created a free flowing system that even allows his center halves, Gallas and Toure, to enter into attack.

2) Set pieces come down to movement (before and during the set piece), placement of the pass and the size of player. Villa are great at set pieces due to their fantastic blend of size (Carew, Mellberg and Bouma) and speed (Young and Agbonlahor). Reading on the other hand do well with a physical style of play and exceptional movement off the ball. Stems primarily from their great academy system. So, I believe it is both something a side chooses to be "good at" and the players available. Man Utd is both good at the set piece and a shot from a set piece. If a club has a player who can put a quality shot on goal from a set piece that gives a defense all that much more to worry about and can free players for a pass. Bullard is emerging as Fulham's primary free kick taker, Man Utd has Ronaldo, Arsenal has Cesc, Chelsea has Ballack and Lampard, Tottenham has Lennon and Jenas... so on and so forth.

Not sure if that answer has cause more confusion or shed some light on the issue, but both are valid questions. Well thought out.

 

To see how the back as winger works, just watch Frankie Hejduk of the Crew...

He can run his ass off for 90 + and still have some juice. Too bad he isnt too good at crossing once he gets up there.

 

Attacking defenders - Came out of the Dutch "Total Football" movement of the 60's.

As Cryuff himself said. "For every disadvantage there is an advantage." (Or something like that).

I am reading Brilliant Orange right now. Pretty interesting - even if you dont like the Orange Nut-jobs.

 

Yeah,,, like I said, Jensers.. Frankie Hejduk. Fits all your statements... including 'nut-job'.

 

Huh. Well I guess I have my dates wrong. I have not finished the book - they are still in the 60's where I am at!

It has been an interesting read thus far. The Dutch are an interesting bunch... Its the weed I guess.

I have read several books as of late about football. The next one I am going to read is, "Among the Thugs." Then after that I was going to give "Football Against the Enemy," a try.

I am trying to get as disillusioned as possible.

 

Re: RE: Soccer 101 question..actually 2

Actually, this helps a lot. Thank you! I wonder if Roy had in his mind to improve upon his set-piece capabilities by bringing in stronger and larger players like Andreasen, Hangeland, and Johnson. I realize they add in other areas as well. Again, I really appreciate the explanation.

 

Re: RE: Soccer 101 question..actually 2

Recommended reading for anyone learning the subtleties of the game?

 

RE: Re: RE: Soccer 101 question..actually 2

Hmmmm... I dont know - I guess it depends on what you are interested in. There is a good list that was put together by FourFourTwo. 50 Best Football Books Ever. Do an internet search then you can see what others have liked and kind of narrow it down to the topics you may be interested in.

 

Attacking Fullbacks

The questions in the original post were covered pretty well, but I would like to add one thing about fullbacks attacking the wings. It's a lot less risky than one might think. The main reason is the cover a back four allows itself. If, for instance, the right back gets beat in a forward position, the two centers and the left back simply slide over and cover his position. The backside can be a little vulnerable to a switch, but you have two things working for you there: 1. Switches take time. 2. The left midfielder will be busting his butt back to fill the now vacant left back role.

Hopefully that makes some sense.

 

Ridge,

I am also no expert but here's my view. The play of your outside backs really is determined by how you play your inside backs and mids and the formation teams use. For instance, if you use what's called a flat back four meaning two outside backs and two interior backs then you have more coverage in the middle (especially when using a defensive mid) than if you played a sweeper/stopper where your interior backs are offset which doesn't allow them to have enough width in the back to handle counter-attacks. The idea behind sending backs into the attack is to pull the opposing defense out of shape by making them choose coverage on multiple attackers coming from different directions (similar to an overlapping run by attackers). This allows the offense to get "numbers" or "numbers up" on the defense and if it's a coordinated attack, WHICHEVER attacker they choose, you make them pay with a through-ball passed in behind the defense or a crossing ball played behind but high (away from goal) enough to make the keeper think twice before coming off his line. The key to this is you have to have backs with the skill and pace to make those runs and crossing passes (Konchesky) and the stamina to get up and back. It also helps if they have a little bit of savvy on when to stay/go. If they always go, it's no surprise and therefore loses it's effectiveness because it can be defensed and countered.

What I've tried (emphasis on tried) to explain here is just playing a flat back 4. Most teams have many variations of many formations and they all try to do the same thing; force the other team into making a mistake.

The coaches task is to find the right combination, put into the right formation, with the right chemistry and level of skill and athleticism to force his opponents mistake without making one himself.

Tall order right?

It sounds like you're a junkie for tactical soccer like me so try this website. It's very good for basics and don't get discouraged.

http://www.brucebrownlee.com/coaching/t ... ctical.htm

 

Bill,

That makes more sense now. I now can see more clearly why they would do it and thanks to RoddyFFC how they rotate to cover the whole left by the attacking back. Very good. Thanks!

Jack

 

Re: RE: Soccer 101 question..actually 2

That guy's stamina never fails to amaze me.

 

That is completely unfair Don! Some of his passes went out of bounds too :lol: .

 

Scoring and giving up goals is a Spurs tradition!! Makes for exciting football. I think that is what attracted me to them from the get go. I love to attack and dont like playing defensive. Breaks your back sometimes tho.

I like the explanations of the defensive organization. I coach high school soccer - we play a stopper sweeper that I try to train to look like a flat 4 on the break (Not that a flat 4 is always flat by any means) and also in rotation.

I would love to play an EPL back 4 all the time, shutting down long balls with an offside trap, negative balls played to a keeper, and generally a keeper who plays off his line. In that equation I can train everything except the linesman... And even when the boys get it right - you are going to be damn lucky if the linesman does.

You think the officials are bad and get it wrong in the EPL? Go see a high school match! It will make you sick!