Olympic Soccer Coverage

Discussion in 'Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International' started by BarryP, Jul 24, 2008.

  1. nevzter

    nevzter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2007
    Location:
    A City by a Bay
    RE: Re: RE: Olympic Soccer Coverage

    i've stated on here many times before that i am 100% behind hiring a foreign coach before some other lifer from the u.s. soccer fed. obviously, it's a two-way street because person "x" needs to want to come to the u.s., but $$$$ can help make that decision easier.

    how many times do we have to hear the same shit after the u.s. lays an egg in an important game? the status quo will keep crashing the u.s. out in the first round...and nowak is about as "foreign" as bradley. who is considered the best manager in mls? probably nichol, and he's not american last time i checked.

    the team was good, mo, and that is why my sleep-deprevity has morphed to anger...but they were not very good or else they'd still be playing. the athletic ability and work-ethic of the team is what kept them in games and the players worked their asses off. aside from Adu and (?), technically the u.s. was shit and undisciplined, and even Adu was undiscplined as well (nice tackle on the dutch goalie btw) - and those are two very important areas where a proper manager can make the difference.
     
    #61
  2. BarryP

    BarryP New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Location:
    Evansville, Indiana
    I am well and truly gutted! I have some thoughts on the match and players I'll share later but that was not a bad red card. The elbow occured after the original foul had been given and you have to know that a deliberate elbow during a time that the official is looking to set a tone for the match is just plain stupid.
     
    #62
  3. nevzter

    nevzter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2007
    Location:
    A City by a Bay
    RE: Re: Olympic Soccer Coverage

    of course it was stupid by orozco, but the ref needlessly injected himself into the match by going with a red at that juncture as it wasn't as if the first 3 minutes were full of hard challenges and dirty play by each side which would necessitate the ref's "setting the tone."

    "the elbow" appeared less-than-malicious and i'll maintain to my dying day that it was a shitty call and an unnecessary red.

    i wish i had a desk like george costanza's because i sure could use a nap today.
     
    #63
  4. Lyle

    Lyle New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    The red was very harsh. Although the players knew about not throwing elbows around.

    The U.S. was unfortunate not to beat the Netherlands. It could have gotten a draw or won, but for the red card this morning.

    Lets not complain too much about the coaching etc... the U.S. is getting better, but the reality is there are lots of other countries that are very good. You can't expect much glory from the U.S. at any tournament. I mean England can't even qualify for the Euros and they haven't made a semi-final at the World Cup in a while.

    It's great that you love U.S. soccer, but realize a quarterfinal at the World Cup is going to be as good as it gets for a long while.

    Maybe we'll win won of the of the youth tournaments or Olympics down the road... when it happens though, it'll be totally random. And that's okay!!!
     
    #64
  5. jmh

    jmh New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2006
    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    I didn't see it because Time Warner cable is fucking useless - is the consensus that the red was harsh?
     
    #65
  6. nevzter

    nevzter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2007
    Location:
    A City by a Bay
    I maintain it was horrible...and if I had my tinfoil hat on I would scream anti-U.S. bias, but I seem to have lost my tinfoil hat.
     
    #66
  7. WhitesBhoy

    WhitesBhoy Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2008
    Location:
    The Beach, For Now
    RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Olympic Soccer Coverage

    In case anyone was wondering, nevzter is not happy with today's result.

    Me neither.

    And actually, he has some points that if not valid, at least deserve consideration, and discussion. I kind of agree that there is something lacking in domestic managers and administrators, and it appears endemic to nearly anyone who thinks they know nearly everything about soccer in the U.S., which is nearly anyone who has played college or beyond, and those who have managed or administered in high school or beyond.

    It is hard to describe, but the words that come to mind are "pompous ignorance". As someone somewhat famous once said, "What if they don't know that they don't know?"

    Answer: Find someone (or some many) that know. And nevzter is on the right track. They most likely ain't gonna be found in the U.S.
     
    #67
  8. timmyg

    timmyg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    wacky? preposterous? insane?

    perhaps.

    but the US and Mexico need to leave CONCACAF.

    and then things will begin to change.
     
    #68
  9. hawkfan_08

    hawkfan_08 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2008
    Location:
    Iowa City, IA
    How can we leave CONCACAF? It has been almost the automatic into the World Cup. We need to keep playing the tough friendlies like we are. Keep the England's, Spain's, Argentina's. It gives us a taste of what we need to get to. It is just like NCAA basketball to me, just get to the dance and anything can happen.

    That said, I understand what you are saying. We will get that new level of play every time out. But to get exposure in the US and to get people more interested we need to keep making it to the WC.

    As far as the olympics I was shattered this morning. That loss really hurt. I don't understand why everybody is getting on Guzan. I thought he played well and made some great saves. Bonehead play by MO and that will kill you evertime. Great effort for 90 minutes a man down. We did everything we could.
     
    #69
  10. Lyle

    Lyle New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    It wasn't a violent elbow, but it was an elbow... and the Nigerian player made a meal of it.
     
    #70
  11. BarryP

    BarryP New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Location:
    Evansville, Indiana
    It was a great effort by the 10 men left on the pitch. In the first three minutes it looked like the US was going to take charge of the match and then the red card to Orozco. I literally felt like all the air had been let out of me. I don't know how the players must of felt but they showed a great deal of mettle during the rest of the match.

    My thoughts on players during the tournament:

    Those that stood out:

    Marvelle Wynne was a revelation to me during this tournament. He truly dominated his side of the pitch. In my opinion he will be challenging Dolo for the RB spot before long.

    Maurice Edu did a solid job at CB. It is to bad we did not have another solid CB so that he could have been pushed to mid when we were a man down. Showed he was playing out of position when he lost the man he should have been marking on Nigeria's first goal.

    Sacha Kljestan is maturing into an outstanding attacking mid. His vision and runs off the ball make him a threat when he touches the ball. He needs to play next to a midfield ball winner to be at his best and seemed to disappear at times during the Nigeria match but I like the way he is developing. It is to bad for the US that Sacha was not playing next to Edu in the final match.

    Freddie Adu is hands down the most creative player in the US pipeline. He needs touches to perform but the US attack is better when it is run through him. If he learns to pass the ball a bit on those weaving runs he will become a leathal assist man.

    Stuart Holden (see the Sacha comments) like Sacha is developing into a nice attacking midfielder. Unfortunately he like Sacha also plays better in the center of the park than he does on the wing. It will be interesting to see how these two young players develop.

    Charlie Davies gets his own mention for the 10 minutes he played against Nigeria. He wreaked havoc putting defenders on their heels, earning the PK and nearly tied the game with the last minute header. It is to bad we did not get to see him a bit earlier. This was easily the best I have seen him play.

    Solid contributiors

    Bradley, McBride, Guzan and Parkhurst. I know Parkhurst got beat on Nigeria's first goal but the defense was under so much pressure it was really only a matter of time.

    Robbie Rogers needs to learn where to place a cross but was the only US winger to consistently put their defender on their heels and then beat them. Wynne was the only other wide threat for the US in the entire tournament.

    Not up to snuff: Sztella and Feilhaber

    The I went to China and got my butt kicked t-shirt goes to Orozco.

    Confused about lack of playing time: Jozy
     
    #71
  12. FulhamAg

    FulhamAg New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Antonio, Texas
    My complaint with the coaches would be squad selection. I don't follow the younger group so much, but why carry so few defenders? Particularly at left back? I got the impression from the announcers that Rogers is a mid who played LB when Orozco got stupid. Edu is a mid who played CB. And we had no bench options to fix the gaping hole down that side? Either we need to do a better job developing defenders or in filling out the side. Wouldn't Don's boy Pearce qualify age-wise for this team? Where was he?

    As for the good, I was particularly impressed with Wynne and what little I saw of Davies. I've never seen Wynne play before and had never heard of Davies. Looking forward to seeing more of both of them. And I was impressed by the effort of the team playing a man down for 87+ min.
     
    #72
  13. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Japan is claiming the penalty kick given to the Netherlands was a harsh call against them. Also, there was the foul by Nigeria's keeper. I dont totally understand how refs call fouls on goalkeepers but Marcelo was saying that if he didnt have two defenders behind him, it would've been a red. I would think a red card foul is a red card foul, why does it matter what two other players are doing? But then I dont rate Marcelo's commentary very high anyway.

    No doubt it seems like the US gets more than its share of harsh and costly fouls but I think it's probably from a lack of respect for the US game (also Japan's) and its players. And that goes back to my problem with your comments about US coaching - a lack of respect for the US's ability to understand a simple game. You are just buying in to that whole mentality. Why do you have to be foreign to understand and coach soccer - that makes no sense? I dont hear anyone saying China or Germany needs American Basketball coaches because they just dont understand the game. No one was calling for foreign coaches for the US womens soccer team.

    Also, how is Nowak not foreign? Being born in Europe, learning soccer in Europe, and playing nearly 20 years of pro soccer there doesnt qualify as foreign?

    The right guy "yes", a mercenary "no". There are already tons of mercenaries here in the US at the youth level, pimping their accents so US parents will pay big bucks to be on their teams or at their camps.


    Whitesbhoy said:

    And you find "pompous ignorance" in coaching for all sports, even sports in which the US dominates. And I can guarantee you find it in football coaching overseas. Are there politics in US soccer that lead to less than optimal decisions, I have no doubt there are, but again I have no doubt the same thing occurs in Europe and South America. Look at FIFA for godsakes. If US soccer is overly insular it is probably because they see all the political crap going on in international football and want to keep it away.

    Maybe northern Ohio is different from the rest of the country, but we have tons of foreign coaches here. Our club is run by a Dutch coach and soccer in all of north Ohio is run by a Scottish coach. I frequently talk soccer with the former and read the writings of the latter and I see no amazing insight or observations. A lot of our local teams are coached by foreigners. I see nothing particularly different in how they coach compared to an experienced US coach. What I do see is that their foreign accents attract what were already the best players in the area and then they end up winning games. The mercenaries I mentioned above.

    My community also has a lot of foreign families living here and a disproportionate amount of our best local soccer players come from these families even though they have had some American coaches. The reason they are good is because they are passionate about soccer not because of coaching - foreign or American. The US is not passionate about soccer and that is the problem with soccer in the US compared to the rest of the world. It is not coaching. We have too few kids that live and breath soccer. I agree that we dont have enough coaches that know what they are doing in the US and that is a need that can be filled by foreign coaches. I just dont think an experienced foreign coach has anything over an experienced US coach.

    This is what matters. The US players mean something to Nowak and Bradley - they're not there for a paycheck. The Olympic and the MNT players give it their all when it counts, they work their asses off, and they are a true team. That is what I care about when it comes to US soccer. The fact is, if the US had held on for 20 more seconds vs the Netherlands, we wouldnt be having this conversation.
     
    #73
  14. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    I watched some of the match again and you (and Petty) are right about Guzan. Not really deserving of the criticism.
     
    #74
  15. Team_of_McBrides

    Team_of_McBrides New Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2007
    Charlie Davies... wow. I know he came on when everyone was gassed, but his pace and ability on the ball were amazing. He created 2-3 chances that about put the US level with Nigeria.

    I know he lacks the experience of McBride, Altidore and Adu, but you have to think he will be featuring more for the USMNT soon. I was blown away and can't wait to see what he can produce in the WC qualifiers.
     
    #75
  16. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    I've read more than once that Jozy's ankle is still a problem. It is either that or what Marcello said during the game - Nowak was playing with one up front so he wanted a MF that could help on the left.
     
    #76
  17. EricD

    EricD New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Location:
    Newport Beach, CA
    Regardless of the outcome, I thought the Dutch penalty against Japan was a joke. It looked like Babel made a move, the ball got too far away from him, he got a little contact, made a meal of it and got the call. I thought it was lame when I saw it.
     
    #77
  18. EricD

    EricD New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Location:
    Newport Beach, CA
    Best showing by Davies that I have seen. It was so much better than the diving crap he was pulling in the qualifiers. Please keep that style of play up.

    I was crushed after that loss to Nigeria, more so than the tie with Holland. I thought our plays played their guts out. The second half was much better than the first.

    One thing I am not sure I saw much written about was the free kick by the Dutch at the end of the game. If it was right outside of the box, why jump? It has to be a perfect strike from that range to go over the wall and drop to hit the net. Balboa was saying that jumping was right. I do not agree. I could see jumping if it was further out, but not that close.
     
    #78
  19. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    That was the first thing my husband said so you're not alone. The netherlands obviously knew our guys would jump that close in so if people want to point to coaching, start here.
     
    #79
Similar Threads: Olympic Soccer
Forum Title Date
Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International US Women's Olympic soccer Aug 6, 2008
Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International Olympic Qualifying Mar 9, 2020
Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International WHU in Olympic Stadium Aug 21, 2016
Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International USWNT Crash Out of Olympics Aug 12, 2016
Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International U23 Olympic Qualifying Oct 1, 2015

Share This Page