Honduras v USA Match Thread

Discussion in 'Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International' started by Clevelandmo, Feb 4, 2013.

  1. HatterDon

    HatterDon Moderator

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    I'm already there. Drop in and ay hi anytime!
     
    #21
  2. LaxAttack

    LaxAttack Well-Known Member

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    Probably should have started Bocanegra. The back line has looked shaky with no organization all day.
     
    #22
  3. SoCalJoe

    SoCalJoe Well-Known Member

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    Thanks to sacffc for the link to the match. Will leave it to the others since I only saw the last 20 minutes or so, but we looked totally spent. To give up a tap in to lose was painful. Plenty of blame to go around between Howard, Cameron, and Gonzalez. The back four is a mess, a point is lost, and with a trip to Azteca in match 3, the upcoming Costa Rican match is vital.
     
    #23
  4. LaxAttack

    LaxAttack Well-Known Member

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    Yup.

    Someone said this on twitter and I agree 100% with it:

     
    #24
  5. nevzter

    nevzter Well-Known Member

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    I couldn't watch the match, but I followed a minute by minute report and it described the U.S. as poor (and that's putting it politely). Hard to believe that Boca didn't start - wonder if he had a knock? Hard to believe you'd throw Gonzalez into his first qualifier on the road in Honduras - that's poor coaching/squad selection and it's on Klinsman's head.
     
    #25
  6. emiusaberbo

    emiusaberbo Member

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    guys why aren't we calling Donovan in as a forward he is pretty good.
     
    #26
  7. nevzter

    nevzter Well-Known Member

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    he's taking some time off from international duty...and like Aerosmith, maybe a "permanent vacation."
     
    #27
  8. HatterDon

    HatterDon Moderator

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    Bocanegra is recovering from a knock and a lot of inactivity. He's well on his way to the downside of his excellent career, and we need to move on.

    I don't hold with those who blame Cameron for the goal. He was tracking back, but when Howard came out to get the ball, he backed off -- which is what I would have done. Timmy hesitated and that was that.

    There were two points in the game where we looked very good, and both of them featured excellent work on the wing by Eddie Johnson. He SHOULD have started up front in a 4-4-2 with Jozy, but SOMEBODY doesn't like to play that adventurous. EJ was subbed off when he was starting to worry Honduras, leaving Jozy on the pitch for 90 minutes. Who was our most ineffective attacker? Jozy. Of course, EJ was a defensive liability; it is not in his game to track back like a real winger. Had he played up front in a 4-4-2 with Jozy ... .

    Honduras was very well organized and took advantage of JK's tendency to be passive for the first 20 minutes. They took control of the game early and, except for a couple of occasions when EJ scared the bejesus out of them, maintained control. Their game plan was to capitalize on the absence of Donovan [and the lack of a substitute second creative play] to climb inside Clint's jersey.

    The first two goals were way out of proportion with the flow of the game. Our goal was classy. My least favorite German scooped a beautiful little pass into the penalty area [what in the name of Bryan Ruiz was he thinking] and Dempsey volleyed it home. Their first goal was one for the highlight reel. Gonzalez made an excellent tackle to concede a corner. The defense cleared it to their left, but it got crossed back in where Figueroa chested it to Garcia who did the bicycle kick past a bemused and blameless Howard. Despite the irritating Scot announcer's effort to hang the goal on poor marking by Cameron and Gonzalez, the two Honduran players were central defenders while our two central defenders would have been marking Espinoza [who was brilliant] and Costly.

    The last goal was inevitable after the USA decided that 1-1 was just fine about 72 minutes into the match. Oh, and serious props to the Costa Rican officiating team. They were very un CONCACAF like -- The ref was very permissive of rough play, and the near linesman [TV perspective] had no hesitation making several close but accurate decisions against the home team.

    I know it's no great crime to lose to this very good team on their home patch, but I have serious concerns about our ability to make the World Cup finals in 2014. We spend too long each game looking like we don't know each other or what the game plan is. We need to expand our net to draw in more central defenders, and we need Donovan in the squad. I know that JK likes to be the charismatic star, but we need both Dempsey and Donovan if we're going to get out of the hex.
     
    #28
  9. CarolinaTim

    CarolinaTim New Member

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    Thank you, Don for your very astute comments about the match. Hope we somehow get a lot better than that showing...
     
    #29
  10. BarryWhite

    BarryWhite Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the summary Don. From what I have listened to the majority opinion is that Klinsmann's subbing off of EJ removed the most effective US player from the pitch. I will give him credit for starting EJ but why pull him? I wish I had seen the match.
     
    #30
  11. LaxAttack

    LaxAttack Well-Known Member

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    He has played the last 2-3 games for his club team before this game, so he had been playing prior to today.

    I agree that he is on he downside of his career and we eventually need to move on, but the back line looked very disorganized and probably could have used his leadership out there. The starting back line today had a total of eight WC caps combined going into today and none in the Hex.
     
    #31
  12. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

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    Most of the guys that came in from Europe did not look good, that was bad luck for us in terms of our schedule. But that is exactly why Klinsmann needed to get a mostly settled roster way before the first game of the Hex, but instead he is STILL experimenting. Still trying to make his points, publicly I might add, to various players. Also when you see your players struggling with tired legs, why not bring in the two players who are most used to playing in the heat and humidity and did not travel all the way from Europe - Gomez and Davis. We sit alone in last place in the Hex. Yes there is plenty of time to turn things around, but I see very little to make me confident that can happen and I cant get Philip Lahm's frightening words our of my head. To go along with Klinsmann's history making friendly victories in Italy and Mexico, he has now presided over our first ever loss to Jamaica (in WCQ to boot) and our first ever loss at Honduras in a WCQ match. Someone call an :auto-ambulance:
     
    #32
  13. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

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    #33
  14. SoCalJoe

    SoCalJoe Well-Known Member

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    Interesting comments on the link. Usually can't stand Lalas' blathering, but have to agree with him that JK needs to stick with Omar. Yes maybe Bocanegra could've of led the line yesterday, but Boca has made more than his fair share of bonehead mistakes. Not sure if it was Conrad, but spot on about WIlliams, Jones, and Bradley not looking like they know what their roles are.
     
    #34
  15. HatterDon

    HatterDon Moderator

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    JK is all hat and no cattle. It's going to take us not qualifying for the World Cup to get him fired. The problem is that a destructive national team coach can poison a squad for years after he's gone.

    Help us Obi wan Zigischmidt, you're our only hope. Well, you and Roberto Martinez.
     
    #35
  16. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

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    The truth you speak Hatter Don.

    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljgUBurxinY[/youtube]
     
    #36
  17. CarolinaTim

    CarolinaTim New Member

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    What did Lahm say, Mo?
     
    #37
  18. Clevelandmo

    Clevelandmo Active Member

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    I remember reading somewhere else that Lahm said Klinsmann left the defensive tactics strickly up to the defenders to decide. It has to be taken with a grain of salt because Lahm also criticized other managers. However, I just feel like what we see with the US on the field is sometimes consistent with Lahm's remarks, but it's probably just me making what I see fit his narrative.

    http://aol.sportingnews.com/soccer/...-philipp-lahm-blasts-jurgen-klinsmann-in-book
     
    #38
  19. AggieMatt

    AggieMatt Well-Known Member

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    I still don't get this obession with playing this odd 4-5-1. Especially the Jurgen version with so damned many defensive mids. If we're going to scrap playing with any width, go to a 4-4-2 and give Jozy another striker for support. Then play Clint on either wing defensively and give him a free role on offense. Much like FFC did under Hughes. Give the opposite winger the option to invert or stay wide and use the fullbacks for width if the wide mids go narrow. Bradley plays box-to-box and you use one of our CDM's like Jones/Williams/Edu/Beckerman to hang back as cover for the back four. They aren't good goal threats anyway. That's pretty much how we played in the Confed Cup.

    But it's the Klinsy show, so I'm sure we'll continue trying to play this en vogue style that's sweeping the world, regardless of how it fits the team or the funky league we play in.

    I don't know what he can do with the back four other than continue to throw them out there until they gel. That and coach them up, but that allegedly isn't in Klinsmann's repertoire. In fairness, time isn't an asset when you have to play midweek qualifiers w/o an int'l break. What moron scheduled that mess? At least we weren't the only ones hurt by it and we didn't throw away a home match as a result.

    I wish the USMNT would stop mirroring Fulham all the time. From no lb, to no strikers, to lacking creativity in midfield, to coaches I have no faith in....whatever trend happens with one, happens with the other. It's really quite annoying.
     
    #39
  20. BarryWhite

    BarryWhite Well-Known Member

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    I am losing heart with Klinsmann because I would have thought by now he would have found a preferred roster and formation and had that group drilled for the Hex but by all appearances he is still experimenting to find something that will work. I was leaning toward the idea Bob Bradley was getting far more out of this pool of players than he should have been expected to get before he was fired. In hindsight, I think that assessment is dead on. Klinsmann should be doing better in terms of decision making and organizational skills but I am truly coming to believe that the talent pool he is dealing with is razor thin.

    I am not sure if Klinsmann abandoned the 4-4-2 because he fancies another formation or becasue the US has a derth of wings. Even if you pull Dempsey back and start him with Zusi where are the backups? Torres, Williams and Kljestan have been given chances to play wide and have proven they don't function well there. Shea has made an impact as a sub but has run hot and cold at best. Robbie Rodgers was given every opportunity and he didn't cut it. As much as Mo wants to see Adu he can't even hold down an MLS spot at the moment and is a lesser option than EJ who is a defensive liability out wide. At least coaches don't complain about EJ's attitude or work rate. Who else is there that is ready?

    Don't get me wrong and think I am making excuses for Klinsmann because his results and the overall performances of his teams has been poor at best but I am not sure how much better Bob Bradley would be doing with this current pool. I hope US soccer is prepared to give Klinsmann's replacement the opportunity to pull in a young pool of players and take some lumps for a while becasue I think we are actually seeing the best of the current group. They must be because both Bob Bradley and Klinsmann have felt the need to keep recycling the same names for the most part.
     
    #40
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