Steed and Sidwell, A Case Study

Discussion in 'Prem talk, Those Other Leagues, and International' started by dcheather, Aug 21, 2006.

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Should Steed play?

  1. yes

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  2. no

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  3. ask me later

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  1. dcheather

    dcheather Administrator

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    Steed and Sidwell are two players in a similiar contract situation; they both have one year remaining, neither has signed an extension, and will most likely leave on a Bosman once the season is over.

    The difference? Coppell is playing Sidwell in the first team over at Reading and scored in Reading's opener. He was committed to the team and very instrumental in their comeback victory for a very well deserved 3 points. Steed, however, is in the reserve squad and Fulham suffered in their performance.

    Yes, no one player is bigger than the team, but he still is a part of the team for the remainder of his contract. We all wish he would do the right thing and go the way of VDS and Runstrom, but that doesn't seem like that is going to happen.

    Should Fulham play their best players, or suffer over a contract standoff and possibly more poor performances without a creative player such as Steed?

    I think he should play, he still can and is willing to contribut to the team for one more year, then his stay is over. This current situation is not helping either party.
     
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  2. HatterDon

    HatterDon Moderator

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    Two situations under which Steed should play:

    1. We showcase him for a team he has agreed to go to IF ... or ...
    2. He enters into negotiations for an extension.

    If the man doesn't want to play for Fulham and hamstrings every effort to trade him, then I say let him rot. CC is putting pressure on his agent. The team will not suffer nearly so much as Steed will.
     
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  3. ChicagoTom

    ChicagoTom Administrator

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    I think Coleman has done the right thing in not playing him. Steed rejected a contract extension and has been a royal pain in the ass in negotiating personal terms with other clubs like Boro.

    While it seems to be a lose-lose situation, this is one area I am proud of Cookie for making a stand. I do not want players who are not committed to the Black and White of Fulham and Steed clearly is not in my opinion.

    I would love to see someone come in and sign Steed in the next week and a half to get this saga over with, but I am not sure it will happen.

    Additionally, Steed is currently undergoing treatment for a groin injury which surely has put a team or two off in trying to sign him.
     
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  4. dcheather

    dcheather Administrator

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    You know this is almost exactly like a prisoner's dilemma situation.

    But in this case it's an athlete and his club in a dilemma:

    Player A wants to play, Club wants Player A to play--he plays a year showcases his stuff, and Club get good player for that one year and time to find replacement? (most win, win situation)
    Player A wants to play, Club doesn't want Player A--player sits out a year, Club gets nothing in return. (lose, lose)
    Player A doesn't play, Club doesn't want Player A--goes to a team cheap (okay, some money to use on another player, but no team is going to spend the proper value on this guy when they can wait)
    Player A doesn't want to play, Club wants him to--breach of contract? (legal battle, court fees. Good for Club, not for Player A)

    It seems the best we can hope for is Steed and Fulham both want each other. Or, Steed no longer wants to stay at Fulham this year, and Fulham make some money off him (but not as much). And Steed doesn't seem to be budging one bit on leaving, so this is unlikely.
     
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  5. FFCinPCB

    FFCinPCB New Member

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    See if anyone wants him until August 31. No takers, cut him off and avoid the speculation by and disruption to the team, club and fans. He becomes a cancer if he is still with us after that.
     
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  6. rumstove

    rumstove New Member

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    While Sidwell has rejected a new contract, has he announced plans to leave on a free after the season like Steed has? If he did then I missed it (and blows my whole basis of argument that the two situations are different) but I was under the impression that Reading offered an extension, he rejected, and the two sides will continue talks again before his contract is up. Sidwell has said he is fully committed to Reading (for this season at least), but I question Steed's commitment to Fulham.

    Steed made it well clear that he fully intends to leave once his contract is up. This hurts his marketability to potential clubs because most will be willing to wait on him until the contract is up since they know he's leaving. The other problem with Steed is he rejected the few clubs that did come asking about him because they didn't fulfill his personal requirements...kinda' like Sol Campbell and his wage demands. Fulham has done nothing to block a move for Steed, but Steed is screwing the club by announcing he wants to leave on a free and not accepting the transfers that are offered to him. Therefore, it's nice to keep him away from the first team that is committed to the club.

    On the other hand, maybe it wouldn't be bad to play him until the January transfer window, let him showcase what he can do, and hopefully attract an offer from a club that Steed will actually agree to. If he's not gone after January then put him to work selling pies during matches or something.
     
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  7. dcheather

    dcheather Administrator

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    Sidwell has rejected Reading's contract offer and demanded more money. It's not 100% certain he will leave after this year, but it is a strong possibility he will leave on a Bosman. He and his agent even played up transfer rumours to two teams to get Reading to increase their offer and has threatened to go. It has Reading fans questioning his commitment to the team. But he has shown that you don't need to sign a an extension to show that a he can be committed to the current one. He is likely getting the the league mininium right now and is probably a better player than half the league.

    I think Steed has stated that he would like to play one more year with Fulham and leave on a free. End of. It is 100% certain he will leave, in my eyes that is the only difference in these two situations. One is 100% certain to go on a bosman, one is prolly 75% and higher? I think Sidwell will prolly look for a team that has European ambitions after the season is over.
     
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  8. FFCinPCB

    FFCinPCB New Member

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    #8
  9. dcheather

    dcheather Administrator

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    RE: Steed

    I certainly hope it's true. Maybe he grew a few brain cells and realized Coleman wasn't budging, so he might as well get something out of it. Rational thinking in Prisoner's Dilemma strikes again? Let's hope.
     
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  10. Spencer

    Spencer Active Member

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    I have to say I agree with Heather here. There could be a million reason for wanting to leave a club. Almost no one plays for one club their whole career. To me as long as the player is committed to playing out his contract with %100 effort then I have no problem with him leaving when the contract is up. You should try and sell the player to cash in on him before he leaves but in the mean time he should play.

    This whole business of "you sign a new contract even though you have a year or two left on the current one, or we'll let you rot in the reserves" is ridiculous. Why would a player decide to come to the club if he knows he'll eventually be put in that position.

    Is it just me or does Fulham not treat its players with the respect it should? I mean forcing players into contracts, never giving young guys a go, releasing Leggy a week before the season. WTF is that? If your letting a guy go do it at the beginning of the summer so he has time to find a new team. Perhaps this is a factor in us not being able to attract new players.
     
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  11. ChicagoTom

    ChicagoTom Administrator

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    Steed was offered a lucrative contract....he turned it down. Fulham does not have the luxury of letting players play out their contracts and letting them go on free Bosman transfers. If Steed is not going to sign a new deal, Fulham needs to make money off him leaving. It is a business decision, not a personnel decision.
    Had this plan worked out the way it was supposd to, Steed would have signed elsewhere a few months ago and not gone on about his high wage demands. Steed was looking for weekly wages he was not worth and not only did Fulham not think he was worth those wages, but other potential clubs were as well.

    I think Coleman took the right stance in telling Steed he was not going to play. Is he a good player, yes. But, one player does not come ahead of the team and Coleman is showing us this. I do not agree with a lot of the things Coleman does, but in this case, I back him 100% and this is one time I like Coleman's stubbornness.

    As for Fulham treating players badly, that could be the case. However, I do not think I have enough knowledge of individual situations to make a knowledgable opinion on this matter. I do not think Fulham has turned off any potential new players by dealing with things the way they have the past few seasons. The onyl thing turning players off to Fulham is low wages and a lack of desire for the club to not just avoid relegation, but to go somewhere inside the top ten. Until those two things change, players will still be hard-pressed to join the club.

    Also, contrary to what you might think Spencer, the idea of signing a contract extension 12-24 months before a contract is up is quite common practice. Most all clubs practice this method as once again it comes down to making money and making a good business decision for the club. After all, this is a business and for a business to succeed, one has to make money.
     
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  12. CStoneNo37

    CStoneNo37 New Member

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    I'm not entirely on Cookie's side here, but to me the problem is that he was refusing transfers. Fulham found takers and Steed wasn't willing to go, so Chris Coleman told him he'd never play again in the hopes that it would wake Steed up and make him realize that if he's going to get a fat contract when the season's over he better start seriously considering these transfers that Fulham is agreeing to.

    That being said, if the transfer window closed with Steed still on the team, you only diminish what you get in return for Steed if you don't play him until the January window. No one's paying top dollar in January for someone who's not in mid-season fitness.
     
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  13. pettyfog

    pettyfog Well-Known Member

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    I think this features the inevitable conflict between coach and player...

    If the player, in his view, has put out 100% and the coach sees it different the seed has been planted..
    Excellent example is the Bluejays' brouhaha last night in which the starting pitcher, having an eight run lead, surrendered five runs then refused to give up the ball when the manager went to the mound to replace him.

    Whether you like it or not, the manager's job is to manage.. the team is not a democracy.

    No player should be able to usurp the manager's job or any part of it... tho the line MIGHT get blurred IF a manager insists a player take the field after injury rehab, though the player thinks it's not quite time. THEN I side with the player.
     
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  14. CStoneNo37

    CStoneNo37 New Member

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    Yeah but I can't help but wonder what's going on with John Gibbons (Blue Jay's manager...). First he and Shea Hillenbrand have a run-in that results in Hillenbrand seeing the door, and after that many media people speculated that Gibbons wasn't far behind him. Now Gibbons has another run-in with a player. And this isn't Ozzie Guillen who has the unwaivering support from his team, gets the most out of his players and has a World Series ring to prove it. The Blue Jays expected to compete in the AL East and they're not even close. I don't expect there will be too many tears shed in the Toronto clubhouse if Gibbons gets the axe this offseason.

    But that's not what this was about at all. Sorry to take it completely off topic, just saying I don't think the parallel is entirely there.
     
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  15. dcheather

    dcheather Administrator

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    I'm not sure if my point was being made or not, the current situation was a lose-lose one (see Prisoner's Dilemma) it didn't make sense for Club or Player for him to rot in the reserves for one year and Fulham get absolutely nothing. We can see at Reading that they at least get the services of Sidwell for 6 months or a year, at least. And they are having difficulty signing new players, similiar to Fulham. To me it just makes sense for Fulham to at least get something from Steed with wanting to stay around another year no matter what.

    I was hoping he would transfer and get something from him, but it didn't seem Steed was or is going with that route. Plus, Fulham are not going to get top dollar for him. It maybe something but they still lose a good talent for little money. With the two non-cooperative players in this situation everyone loses. That's what I want to be avoided at all costs.
     
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  16. FFCinPCB

    FFCinPCB New Member

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    Getting anything for Steed at this point would be a win.
     
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  17. omsdogg

    omsdogg New Member

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    I think Coleman is doing the right thing. Steed needs to realize that the club is what's most important to Coleman, hence the decision to ban Steed from the first team. In the long run Steed is paying for his greed because teams are not going to offer him anywhere near the wages he's demanding (that article says that West Ham are offering half), and if he rots in the reserves until January or the end of the season, his value will decrease even more and he'll get even less. His idiotic agent needs a big piece of humble pie and needs to realize that Steed is not a world class player and will not get 60,000 pounds a week. It reminds me of the Terrell Owens situation with his egotistic agent Drew Rosenhaus. That did Owens a lot of good with the Eagles that final year. Someone should tell that to Steed!!!
     
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  18. dcheather

    dcheather Administrator

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    Also, P-fog I don't think your analogy really fits. Yeah, a player should go along with the manager's descisions for games, practices, and team rules. But I don't think that is what is at issue here. This is a contract matter.

    A better analogy might be to look at from an employee at a law firm point of view. The employee has had some success at the law firm but wants to move on once his contract is over. The partners decide they want to extend the contract and offer more money. The employee refuses new contract but wants to remain at the firm to fulfill his contract obligations. The law firm not happy with this has a couple of options: (1) fire him--said lawyer sues them for unjust termination, (2)keep him on but give him pathetic work--said lawyer gets his pay, but law firm loses valuable work. (3) keep things as is until contract is up and firm has time to find replacement. I'm sure there might be another option but I can't think of one at the moment.

    I know everyone loves Fulham on these boards and wants the club to come out victorious in this situation. But this is professional sports, professional athletes are going to look out for their self-interest no matter what. If you want to see athletes play for the love of the game and club, stick to watching amateurs. Professional athletes are only doing what we do at our places of business. If we are unhappy we look for a raise or leave. We don't sign a contract so the company can make a small bundle before we go. It's nice when a player does this, but it isn't going to happen 100% of the time. And, usually, the club just gets rid of the athlete before hand.
     
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  19. SCFulhamFan

    SCFulhamFan Active Member

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    This is certainly a hot topic with everyone! My view is this:
    Fulham needs to create a good working order to the flow of Fulham during their matches. Having someone who doesn't want to stay at Fulham in the lineup can only hurt the team chemistry. Coleman might be too harsh in not letting him play at all, but I certantly wouldn't start him. Keep him on the bench and add him when you need to.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
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  20. pettyfog

    pettyfog Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, Heather... I didnt mean it as a four-footed analogy. Just a similar situation.

    CC wouldnt back down, at any rate. And I'm not sure he should.

    It would be nice if CC had as much guts, introspectively, as the Crew's Sigi Schmid and could wonder aloud if he wasnt the problem... but he doesnt, same as most managers.

    I'd settle if CC would simply examine his training and coaching staffs, but that's another topic.
     
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