Bringing relegation to the MLB?

I think this could be such a great idea! As a heart-broken Seattle Mariners fan, I'm wondering how to give our owners and GM's a kick in the butt to take the game more seriously than the business. Relegation could be the answer!
It would enable those mid-major cities (Portland, Memphis, etc.) who have really nice AAA stadiums and teams and fan support to be able to step up to big game. I know Portland had been toying with an expansion team a few years ago, but nothing materialized.
There'd have to be some sort of breakdown in the current farm system, but I think it would also be an incentive for the up-and-coming players to develop as a team.
And I think my personal reasoning is that I could actually care about the M's season in years like last year. Instead of just being glorified AAA practice (the called up a ton of guys the second half of last season) they could actually be playing for something.

It seems like it could be a financial benefit to the league as a whole too, because not only would fans come out to see ML teams not get booted to AAA, but the fan support would grow considerably in Mid-major cities.

So what else would need to happen or be considered to make this happen?

Looking to put a fire under the M's,

Bforbes

 

I wouldn't bet on this ever happening. It's a huge departure from the traditional structure of North American sports. If I'm the owner of an MLB team, I can't see any reason why I'd support this.

 

The biggest problem is the Minor Leagues themselves. After all they are (except for the Independent League) affliated w/MLB teams. They're run for the most part solely to develop players w/the "Big Clubs" agendas to be served. The inherent conflict of interest (i.e. sending players down, recalling players up) would make it impossible to do w/out a complete overhaul (I think Pettyfog would vote for Hilary before that would ever happen).

The U.S. sport that would be great for relegation battles is the NFL (again pigs would fly before it would ever happen). You might actually gain interest in a late season Texan-Browns matchup. There would have to be a "Championship" league developed (The Mountain Dew Pigskin Conference). There are plenty of mid-major cities w/out NFL teams from which to choose (Portland, San Antonio, Birmingham, Tulsa, lol Los Angeles, etc..). Lord knows the Arizona Cardinals have been raking in millions of dollars in pure profit and should have been relegated 20 times over.

I will say watching relegation battles have been enjoyable. That last day in which Palace got dropped and West Brom stayed up was enthralling. This time around w/my favorite team involved has been less thrilling and more excruciating.

Bforbes, my brother the Mariner fan would agree w/your view of lighting a fire under the brass up there. However, since I'm an Angels fan I think the M's should stay the course, develop slowly, and concentrate on winning only when they're playing Oakland and Texas.

 

Why not just address it at the core and either force the owners of the bottom two teams to sell or fine them 20% of the value of the median team in the league.

The net effect is the same.

And you'll see the Prem do away with relegation before you see it adopted in any other leagues. Relegation is impractical and anachronistic.

 

I guess I'm just dreaming up ways to actually care when the M's are mediocre. I'd have kept an eye on their season last season just to make sure they don't get booted. Instead, I was checked out before the all-star break. So it may be impractical, but this whole thing is a big "what if". Wouldn't this generate interest (aka $) in both losing ML teams and those upper level AAA teams? I think of Portland and they're on the cusp of being a city that can suppport more than one major sports team. And wouldn't this generate more and higher priced media deals in such towns if they had the potential to move up? It just seems like it would generate community support which would also increase the amount of money brought in.

But I really know nothing other than I am obsessed with Fulham's relegation battle yet don't find a myself with a parallel obsession with the sonics this year or the mariners last year. You'd never see a losing, sub-par Mariners team sell out the last home game of the season even if was against the Yankees or Red Sox or whatever team parallels Liverpool.

 

The Columbus Clippers AAA are talking to the Dayton Dragons A club to study how they run such a successful operation and stadium. The Dragons have approx the same attendance.

The ironic thing is that's almost the ONLY thing in Dayton that's a success. But a large part of it is they built a park that's modeled on the best attributes of Fenway and Wrigley

 

In retrospect the MLB is very much like the relegation system in England only not by the team, but by the players...If a player doesn't perform then he gets "relegated" which ultimately can be described as the same thing considering that if each individual does his job fairly well then the whole team is going to do well, because baseball is one of those sports that see individual effort as being a prime reason as to a team being good or not...

 

Anything to make the game more exciting, sorry but Im not a baseball fan, and I can't stand when baseball people say soccer is boring.

 

I think relegation would be interesting, and if it were ever done in the US (which it won't), it would have to be with baseball, simpky because it's the only sport with enough teams and enough players to support a multi-level league system.

Two things I think that would be really bad about it though. First, there would be no draft...can you imagine an amateur draft that included all MLB teams, as well as all AAA, AA, High A and Low A teams?!? Each team would get like one player a year!

And without the draft and without a salary cap, the result would be (much like we see in the EPL) absolute domination by the 2 or 3 teams (Yankees, Red Sox most definitely) who could afford to sign whoever they want. They sort of do that now anyway, but it seems to me like it'd only get worse.

 

While I don't see it being possible to do with the MLB, I would like to see something like that enacted for the MLS and USL's. THAT at least would make sense.

But I don't see that happening until the league is better situated and profitable. I predict it being a possibility once you get the MLS to about 16+ teams and do away with the Conference set up.

Why do you think our North American setup will work instead of the European system, which has obviously prospered for a century, give or take a few years.

 

How about:

Because MLS will never rival the NFL and it would have to for relegation to work

Because the FA and Bundesliga study the NFL {structure, not marketing}, not the other way around

And the supposition that the "European System" has prospered is not exactly true. Even though they are the 'NFL equivalent'

When we can all teleport to any city in the US at a cost of $24.99, THEN we'll do away with conferences.

 

So this MLB season for me is another reason why I just don't care: The Mariners are 19-21 right now with a quarter of the season done. I would be so much more excited about following the mariners if I knew they weren't just going to scrap this season. I don't know if you've had this experience following you favorite MLB team but I hate it when they basically shut down after the all star break and you get to pay MLB prices to watch a AAA team.

I think the reason that europe studies the NFL is simply the fact that they've suckered the America into shelling out a ridiculous amount of money for tickets, TV rights, naming rights, merchandising, etc. I seriously doubt they're looking at the NFL for lessons on a season format.

Anyways, this was all just in my vain hope that one day the M's would be pressured into caring about a season all the way through even if they aren't winning...

 

Well, BF.... I will just have to respectfully agree to disagree. No one beats the Prem, at least top four, for marketing.

They are trying to keep some semblance of competition in the leagues.

Your views may differ of course, that's why there's bet shops.

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And are the Mariners ten games out? Then kwitcherwhinin! I'd be thrilled, at this point, if the Reds were only 5.5 out.

 

Fair enough, but are you following the Reds right now, or just kind of keeping an eye on them, waiting to see if they're going to right the ship? If you are following them, then good luck!

Speaking of marketing, I'm pretty excited about this LG deal. It's a pretty hot company right now.

 

It is a hot company/brand.... and frankly, I'm torn about Fulham only getting 3 million a year from them. On the other hand they have a top flite sponsor for once.. really a world brand.

Raises interesting thoughts about sponsors and football. Seems to me, LG is likely to get as much or more boost from sponsoring Fulham as AIG gets from sponsoring ManUre - for 30 million.

Think about who buys what and what they look at when they buy.
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I watch the Reds with a bag over my head.. hard to keep track of the remote with it on, though.

Reds are a classic case of each skill position in sport needing competent coaching. For the Reds manager to get fired because of his pitching coach's lack of influence seems ridiculous but that's what is going to happen.

 

And what about simply getting the talent to compete at that level? It seems like they expect managers to be miracle workers and not manage the talent before them. It seems like an awful lot of managers end up being fall guys for a lack of front office work.

 

The irony of this is that the English league system came into being from a letter Villa's McGregor received from an Ex-pat observing the development of the National League. Relegation was the extra touch the English put on it.

I think the concept could've saved independent baseball in this country. If you go back 60-80 years ago, just about every town in the nation had a professional or semi-pro baseball team. That died out with the arrival of television and the expansion of the major leagues across the nation. But many of these clubs would've surivived with a promotion/relegation scheme in place. The idea gives football fans in England something to hang their hopes upon. One day, their club could be the next Wimbledon or Yeovil Town. That ambition keeps plenty of clubs going who in an American-like set-up would die off unless chosen as a farm club by a major team.

 

First, I think relegation would be awesome from the fan's perspective. However, because of the patriarch/scion relationship between Major League teams and their farm systems, that will never happen. One possible solution would be for the "relegated" big league team to simply switch places with its AAA affiliate until the big squad gets its act together at the minor league level.
All I know is, I'm tired of seeing teams like the KC Royals drop a steaming load of suck on the league year after year.

Go Cardinals.

 

Like I said.. relegation aint gonna happen, even in MLS.. but cases like KC point to the need for 'financial disincentives' which might remove tax writeoff issues from allowing your team to suck.